Anyone else getting a lot of chroma noise/ noise on a7rii?

[bbphoto]

I know this is a tired subject (the hot pixels), but I'm referring to actual color noise and normal noise. 

 

I know RAWs produce cleaner image, but I often shoot jpeg for storage reasons (unless its work), and find that the SOOC files (shooting with NR turned off) are much less detailed than I'd expected and full of color noise.

 

Have a look and please let me know if you are or aren't getting similar results without NR sooc jpegs.

 

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[bbphoto]

More at a lower ISO without adjustments

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[puffy]

Yikes!

[bbphoto]

Some kind of horizontal moire pattern at low ISO in hair. I haven't seen this on my images on prior cameras 

 

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[3dit0r]

I shoot RAW only, so I do t usually look at JPEG output, but that doesn't look right to me on a camera at the level of the A7rii.

[OlHeath]

Yes!

 

I keep looking for people discussing this, i dont know if its my copy or the camera, but i was quite shocked at how much noise there is in the images, at ISO 100. Its a strange, hazy noise, often clearly visible not even in shadows. It doesnt look right to me. The images are not clean at ISO 100. Particularly photographing buildings on a grey day. Hazy speckles everywhere... Well thats an exaggeration, but its noticeable. Slightly better on C1 than LR.

 

Are other people finding anything similar?

[OlHeath]

Is there a way to embed images on here without a URL, eg off the hard drive?

[alastc]

I've noticed a lot of noise at relatively low ISOs (1000+), but I want sure if it was just because I've been using an A7S, which is not only great at high iso but 12mpix, so viewing 1:1 will be very different.

 

I haven't sold the A7S yet, so I will try a comparison test. Any advice for doing an accurate comparison?

 

Same scene, lens, position, manual settings, anything else?

[bbphoto]

I've noticed a lot of noise at relatively low ISOs (1000+), but I want sure if it was just because I've been using an A7S, which is not only great at high iso but 12mpix, so viewing 1:1 will be very different.

 

I haven't sold the A7S yet, so I will try a comparison test. Any advice for doing an accurate comparison?

 

Same scene, lens, position, manual settings, anything else?

Downsample resolution of a7rii to match the 12mp of a7s!

[alastc]

Downsample resolution of a7rii to match the 12mp of a7s!

 

Yep, I did think of that, but good point!   :-)

 

I'm in a hotel so lacking tripod I made do with resting on a chair, I think the results are better than I expected:

https://db.tt/Bxj2YojJ

 

Hopefully you can see the names (in the URL if nowhere else), each is "ISO xxx A7R2/A7S"

• A7R2 & A7S
• FE 55mm prime.
• Hotel setting (um, not trying to advertise the hotel, but the coffee thing made the best subject!)
• ISO 2,000 to 102,400 (and a bonus 256,00 on the A7S, because it can).
• All imported to lightroom, didn't touch any settings except to bump exposure up 0.33 on the A7R2 as they appeared slightly darker.
• All exported at the 12Mpix size (4,240x2832), with a full size one from the A7R2 at ISO 12,800 because that's the point where the grain gets really noticable and a full size one show it best. Preference obviously vary, but I'd be happy upto that point with some noise reduction.

Regarding my 'expectations', I think I have been put off by the appearance of the picture when reviewing on the camera, and the result on the computer is a lot better than it appeared to be in-camera.

 

Also, I've notice my habits from the A7S have lead me to standardise on higher ISOs and quicker shutter speed. However, I'm learning with the A7R2 to lower the shutter speed and rely on the IBIS instead of ISO.

 

I'm sorry, I'm not seeing the chroma/noise at low ISOs in jpeg either. I tried the same environment with a jpeg at ISO 5,000 and it seems fine:

 

What I do wonder is about the shutter speed for your pics, with a 70-200 it's quite low, is it perhaps a combination of slight blur + noise?

[OlHeath]

Finding much less noise using C1, and even using C1 just for sharpening and noise after doing basic edit in LR.

[Bitchinlight]

This is what I call "flat surface noise".  After using several lenses, loxia 35mm, FE 55mm and a couple Leica's I noticed this issue.  It seems most noticable at lower iso settings, 50-200.  I found that i was using luminace slider on all these photos!  Ridiculous for that low of an ISO setting.   It occurs mainly on flat surfaces.  It appears to be a Lightroom issue.  There is virtually no noise importing in capture one. 

Hopefully Adobe will address this quickly.  I really don't want to learn another software! 

 

Eric Thomson

[bbphoto]

This is what I call "flat surface noise".  After using several lenses, loxia 35mm, FE 55mm and a couple Leica's I noticed this issue.  It seems most noticable at lower iso settings, 50-200.  I found that i was using luminace slider on all these photos!  Ridiculous for that low of an ISO setting.   It occurs mainly on flat surfaces.  It appears to be a Lightroom issue.  There is virtually no noise importing in capture one. 

Hopefully Adobe will address this quickly.  I really don't want to learn another software! 

 

Eric Thomson

Thanks Eric. Surely importing the sooc jpegs into LR yields same results as in c1, though right? With in-cam high iso NR turned off.

[bbphoto]

Yep, I did think of that, but good point!   :-)

 

I'm in a hotel so lacking tripod I made do with resting on a chair, I think the results are better than I expected:

https://db.tt/Bxj2YojJ

 

Hopefully you can see the names (in the URL if nowhere else), each is "ISO xxx A7R2/A7S"

• A7R2 & A7S
• FE 55mm prime.
• Hotel setting (um, not trying to advertise the hotel, but the coffee thing made the best subject!)
• ISO 2,000 to 102,400 (and a bonus 256,00 on the A7S, because it can).
• All imported to lightroom, didn't touch any settings except to bump exposure up 0.33 on the A7R2 as they appeared slightly darker.
• All exported at the 12Mpix size (4,240x2832), with a full size one from the A7R2 at ISO 12,800 because that's the point where the grain gets really noticable and a full size one show it best. Preference obviously vary, but I'd be happy upto that point with some noise reduction.

Regarding my 'expectations', I think I have been put off by the appearance of the picture when reviewing on the camera, and the result on the computer is a lot better than it appeared to be in-camera.

 

Also, I've notice my habits from the A7S have lead me to standardise on higher ISOs and quicker shutter speed. However, I'm learning with the A7R2 to lower the shutter speed and rely on the IBIS instead of ISO.

 

I'm sorry, I'm not seeing the chroma/noise at low ISOs in jpeg either. I tried the same environment with a jpeg at ISO 5,000 and it seems fine:

 

What I do wonder is about the shutter speed for your pics, with a 70-200 it's quite low, is it perhaps a combination of slight blur + noise?

Thanks for running this test! Your results are indeed pretty pleasing in regards to a7rii. May I ask if you had in-camera high ISO NR turned on or off? I have gotten excessive color noise on my 55mm at higher shutter speeds as well, so I feel as if it's something else..

[alastc]

I hadn't touched high ISO NR so it was on the default... let me see. It would have been 'Normal'.

 

Most of the test I did in RAW apart from the last one at ISO 2000 with the default setting. I can try again tonight at a lower ISO if that helps?

 

Do you get the low-ISO noise in RAW or with the default setting?

[Bitchinlight]

Thanks Eric. Surely importing the sooc jpegs into LR yields same results as in c1, though right? With in-cam high iso NR turned off.

I don't shoot jpg's bb.  can't speak to that.  I tried with wind NR on and off.  no difference.  Long Exp NR, off, high iso off(this is a low iso issue).  Results of c1 import of raw files and LR are very different. 

[DJ27]

With my A7r I had no noise issue, this new A7r II needs a Sony Firmware update and soon, starting to want my A7r back!!

I'm using Sony FE Lenses which cost an arm and a leg and still poor quality images with noise and low detail in shadows.

Sony make great cameras I just hope I didn't jump the gun with my new A7rII ( maybe wait a little time would be my take on anyone thinking of an upgrade to this camera)

[alastc]

I'm using Sony FE Lenses which cost an arm and a leg and still poor quality images with noise and low detail in shadows.

 

That doesn't seem to be what other people are getting, I've been generally impressed with the quality and detail in shadows. The only thing that got me was the quality of the on-camera review of low-light shots, but they were fine on the computer...

[DJ27]

The A7r II is great but I'm really not seeing that much if any improvement in RAW images ( my A7r had less noise better shadow detail).

I have the same camera set up as my old A7r and shoot on auto ISO. Processing the RAW files with the new Adobe Camera Raw could be an issue but I have also used the Sony software and several other RAW converting applications, Capture One does a superb job on the files from the A7r II (just not as good as my A7r).

I'm happy with the other new tech of the A7r II

the viewfinder is fantastic, the AF super slick, I should really stop pixel peeping and be happy.

[alastc]

I should really stop pixel peeping and be happy.

 

Have you tried exporting the A7R2 images at the same size as the A7R's? 

 

I think our perception of the noise is being affected by the zoom-factor... mine certainly was (coming from the A7S!)

[DJ27]

Thanks, I will give that a go.

 

I would also be interested if anyone had Steady Shot (in camera) turned on / off with the noise issue?

[alastc]

I've had it on (auto).

[NamarBurton]

Yes!

 

I keep looking for people discussing this, i dont know if its my copy or the camera, but i was quite shocked at how much noise there is in the images, at ISO 100. Its a strange, hazy noise, often clearly visible not even in shadows. It doesnt look right to me. The images are not clean at ISO 100. Particularly photographing buildings on a grey day. Hazy speckles everywhere... Well thats an exaggeration, but its noticeable. Slightly better on C1 than LR.

 

Are other people finding anything similar?

I have this same problem... I wasn't sure if it's my model or an a7rII pitfall.

[Murchphoto]

I am also experiencing what I would call a serious issue with blotchy colour noise in my RAW files from the A7R II.  I cannot find enough discussion of the issue to know whether it is a problem with a few specific sensors or all A7RII's.  I used Capture 1 and it greatly reduced the issue compared to LR but did not eliminate it entirely, but I'm hoping it more of a RAW converter problem than an actual sensor issue.  It'd be nice to know if I need to get my camera replaced or it'll be something that will be fixed down the road. 

[pdrphoto]

I use the A7RII only in raw.. Anyway also in raw the perception of the grain/rumor is not always as you can expect...

I found in some pics more rumor at iso like 250, 320 or 640 than 800, 1000 or 1600