A7Rii with Canon TS-E 24mm f/3.5L II

[AndyH]

Hi there,

 

I'm still new to shooting Sony after years of using Canon.  I actually bought the A7Rii as a drone camera, but am so impressed with it I have taken to using it for landscapes and other commercial jobs.

 

Either way, something occurred to me - 

There is seemingly no depth of field preview button!!  WHAT?!   So, a little bit of reading later and I discovered that instead of hitting the DoF preview button to simulate DoF on say a Canon 1Dx, the view you are seeing in the EVF and back screen is a simulation of the DoF.  Ok, so on the face of it, that sounds like a good start.  BUT - As I'm sure many of you will know, when dealing with precision placement of the focal plane, I want to be able to see the live view preview at 100% WITH the depth of field preview in place.  It seems this is not possible with the A7Rii, and that when you use the focus magnifier you are looking at the preview "wide open."  

 

I am yet to put this into practice.  I'm headed out later today to shoot a sunset composition I have in mind.  If there really is no DoF simulation / preview when zoomed in with the focus magnifier, then I'd say the only way to ensure proper placement of the focal plane with this lens is to shoot test frames and adjust accordingly.  I have read that the focus peaking will take the pain out of this.  I hope it does, I can't see how it could be accurate enough to rely on when the focal plane is tilted all the way forwards.  I guess I'm about to find out.   

 

 If anyone has any other thoughts on this, I'd love to hear them!

 

I'll post this evening with my findings.

 

[Marc Contaxtonikon]

Hi there,

 

I'm still new to shooting Sony after years of using Canon.  I actually bought the A7Rii as a drone camera, but am so impressed with it I have taken to using it for landscapes and other commercial jobs.

 

Either way, something occurred to me - 

There is seemingly no depth of field preview button!!  WHAT?!   So, a little bit of reading later and I discovered that instead of hitting the DoF preview button to simulate DoF on say a Canon 1Dx, the view you are seeing in the EVF and back screen is a simulation of the DoF.  Ok, so on the face of it, that sounds like a good start.  BUT - As I'm sure many of you will know, when dealing with precision placement of the focal plane, I want to be able to see the live view preview at 100% WITH the depth of field preview in place.  It seems this is not possible with the A7Rii, and that when you use the focus magnifier you are looking at the preview "wide open."  

 

I am yet to put this into practice.  I'm headed out later today to shoot a sunset composition I have in mind.  If there really is no DoF simulation / preview when zoomed in with the focus magnifier, then I'd say the only way to ensure proper placement of the focal plane with this lens is to shoot test frames and adjust accordingly.  I have read that the focus peaking will take the pain out of this.  I hope it does, I can't see how it could be accurate enough to rely on when the focal plane is tilted all the way forwards.  I guess I'm about to find out.   

 

 If anyone has any other thoughts on this, I'd love to hear them!

 

I'll post this evening with my findings.

 

Hi,

 

to my knowledge, the display is WYSIWG - in other words - you are seing the picture as captured by the sensor with the actual F-stop you have chosen. I have a limited perspective, as I only use the A7II with CY Zeiss glass - in that case I am 100% certain tht you see the actual F-Stop

[Markoe]

Hi,

 

I just used my A7R2 and Canon 24TSE-ll this weekend for a landscape shoot. I'll have to upload some images from that shoot when I can. The lens performed beautifully and the 100% zoom and focus peak is the ONLY saving grace using this lens.  Works better on Sony than my Canon 5DSR unless I'm tethered to an Ipad via CamRanger.

 

I'll post asap.

 

Thanks,

Markoe

[LostBoyNZ]

Hi,

 

In the menu ("Settings cog", then Page 3) is Live View Display Setting Effect turned on? If it's turned off, it'll be wide open until you shoot. If it's on however, it should show you you're exact exposure and depth of field live.

 

Hopefully that helps I've also got the same lens and body, they're a great combo!

 

- Graham

[Bluebird]

Just be really careful with manual focus - I use the A7RII for my architecture work and it is significantly more touchy to use than the old 5DIII. There is no focus confirmation beep, you just have the focus peaking and zoom. The focus peaking is not accurate enough with the 24mm TS-E II, I am getting a fair few slightly out of focus images at F11 unless I use the live view zoom.  And the zoom is grainy enough to also give some latitude on exactly where focus is.  F16 is better but I don't like shooting at it generally. 

 

Due to major damage to the Sony (written off by Sony after falling into sand), I had to use the old 5DIII on a shoot today. I have to admit it was much faster, more accurate to focus and gave me a quicker workflow.

[AndyH]

My unit is set up correctly for this type of shooting.  I did shoot with it the other evening, and I had to have the focal plane tilted quite far forward.  I can see the focus peaking picking up on areas where the plane of sharpness is greatest, so it is useful in that respect.  BUT, its very sloppy and dose not give a firm indication of what is truly "in" the focal plane.  The shoot did work, but it required many many test frames to get the result that would have taken me seconds on an SLR.  This Sony is actually to go in a drone, so I won't have a real need to tilt, I was only wanting to experiment with 42MP files shot through the TS-E.  It is very impressive when it works, but I have to say I will be using the 1Dx and 5DMk3 for this type of work from now on.  I think Sony are a little short sighted in not including a DoF preview button :-(  What about hyper focal focussing?  I use this a lot too, and this would be nigh on impossible with the DoF preview button.

[Amfibius]

I think Sony are a little short sighted in not including a DoF preview button :-(  

 

 

 DOF preview button is not necessary. The display is WYSIWYG - any changes to the aperture are automatically shown on the display. 

[AndyH]

Compared to the precision of how you can use a tilt lens on a pro SLR, the Sony is awful.  I know it is WYSIWYG, but it is not accurate enough.  Either way I will persevere.  Sorry if it sounds like I'm slating the Sony system, I am not, these are just my findings.

[padam]

With the Metabones IV Smart adapter it works just like an SLR you focus it wide open and just before the exposure it steps down the aperture. And there is a DOF preview if you want to.

 

But focusing wide open is not always preferable if the lens has focus shift.

 

But you can also use the Metabones adapter's Advanced mode

Where the aperture change is instant so just like using a manual lens but because it has electronic connection it magnifies automatically when you move the focus ring. It's pretty neat.

 

Either way, with the magnification the focusing is very precise on these Sony cameras.

[Guest all8]

My unit is set up correctly for this type of shooting.  I did shoot with it the other evening, and I had to have the focal plane tilted quite far forward.  I can see the focus peaking picking up on areas where the plane of sharpness is greatest, so it is useful in that respect.  BUT, its very sloppy and dose not give a firm indication of what is truly "in" the focal plane.  The shoot did work, but it required many many test frames to get the result that would have taken me seconds on an SLR.  This Sony is actually to go in a drone, so I won't have a real need to tilt, I was only wanting to experiment with 42MP files shot through the TS-E.  It is very impressive when it works, but I have to say I will be using the 1Dx and 5DMk3 for this type of work from now on.  I think Sony are a little short sighted in not including a DoF preview button :-(  What about hyper focal focussing?  I use this a lot too, and this would be nigh on impossible with the DoF preview button.

 

Please read again this helpful post, DOF preview is called "Live View Display Setting Effect" which can be set to "On".

 

Hi,

 

In the menu ("Settings cog", then Page 3) is Live View Display Setting Effect turned on? If it's turned off, it'll be wide open until you shoot. If it's on however, it should show you you're exact exposure and depth of field live.

 

Hopefully that helps I've also got the same lens and body, they're a great combo!

 

- Graham

 

 

AND AND AND there is also "Aperture Preview" which can be assigned to a custom button and will do a DOF preview if you have the above setting tuned "Off".

 

I suggest trying again   

 

 

And consider an external monitor (Sony offer a 5" model, Shogun is 7") as they probably make focusing much easier. I'm considering one myself because I have similar problems in getting precise focus and DOF - the LCD is not high res enough, and the EVF is not always so easy to look through.

 

Peaking is more or less useless for precise focusing.

[Bluebird]

While focus peaking is nice, I'd far prefer to have focus confirmation for the focus points I have selected.  On a £2.5k camera, I should really not need to use an external monitor just to see if my photo is ok. The other really major irritation is the sloppy electronic level - it's basically bloody useless on a tripod. There is a +/- 3 degree or more latitude on it - using my geared tripod head, I can tilt or roll the camera a fair bit before the level moves from green. Sure, it needs to be a bit insensitive in order for hand-held use but there could easily have been a sensitivity option for use on a tripod. 

 

I will keep my Sony but am seriously considering not using for my professional architecture work - it interferes with workflow a bit too much and slows me down to the point of costing me time and thus money. 

 

Oh, plus Sony service is ... different. MY 24-70 lens broke along with my a7RII. The rear lens mount came off but optics looked fine. The camera's IS stopped working and there was some sand and water ingress in the battery compartment. It actually worked fine for the remaining 10 days of a vacation aside from no IS.  Sony wrote off the camera and were going to charge me £800 to repair a lens that can be bought for £100 less. And took 10 days. For professional use, I need to know my equipment will be repaired fast, cost effectively and good communication. Canon do this so well that I feel a little spoilt

[AndyH]

Interesting feedback, thank you all.

 

I have been experimenting with the Live View Display " Setting Effect."  Neither seem to offer anywhere near the accuracy of a pro SLR in term of getting the forward tilt set correctly.  Especially if you have a complex scene I need to know I have nailed it.  Sadly, as much as I'd love to use this sensor for architecture and properties I shoot, it will have to stay in the bag :-(  I bought the A7Rii to sit in a drone, and I'm sure it will be excellent at that.  (Taking delivery of an FreeFly Alta in two weeks.)  I use a 5DMk3 and a 1Dx for most of my work, and they are fantastic.  I'm very much looking forward to the 1Dx Mk2.  

 

With regard the electronic level - This is another reason why this camera is a pain to shoot with.  I almost always make sure the focal plane is correct on the X and Y axis, but Sony's electronic level is utterly terrible.  I have to say, it was one of the first things that pissed me off, and it still does :-(

 

All of these things are so easy to Sort out from Sony's end, I am very surprised they have not listened.  Perhaps we will see these things sorted out in an upcoming firmware update?  And hopefully a custom programmable menu so I don't have to play lucky dip in the menus while searching for settings.

[Monochrome]

I use focus peaking (sometimes after first using the iPhone's Tilt Calculator app) to get close to the tilt and/or shift I want. This is similar to how I run Magic Lantern for focus peaking on my Canon dSLR. Then I fine focus using the 11x magnified view, moving the 11x point around as needed (also very much as I do on my Canon). I programmed the C3 button (which zooms images if reviewing a captured image) for focus zoom.; first press shows the spot it will zoom to (you can then move the spot if needed), 2nd press is medium zoom but I usually immediately press a 3rd time for the 11x view for final adjustment. Sony's default to move the zoom spot back to the center is the Trash Can button; it helps to move the 11x focus spot around from the same starting point.

 

As others have already suggested, aperture stop down is on another custom button but Advanced Mode on the Metabones should zoom the moment you start to focus (I've not tried this, however) or you can set "setting effect" to ON (default is off, as I recall).

 

Another Focus Peaking customization is see which color and which of the three possible peaking levels work best for you. Set the display to be in monochrome so that the colored (I use yellow) focus peaking lines stand out on the monochrome image. It would be nice if the Sony's peaking offered all the focus peaking tweaks that Magic Lantern offers running on a suitable Canon dSLR body (along with ML's bracketing with up to 9 image captures, focus stacking, etc. etc.).

 

Finally, I am still in the process of setting up the Sony and the Canon to have similar functions on similarly located buttons (e.g. back focus button). I've yet to delve into using the Sony's  custom 1 and 2 settings on the PSAM dial or the additional custom setups than are saved on the SD card. With Sony's option of SD card-specific setups, you could have an SD card for sports, another for wildlife, another for studio portraits, etc. Setting up the Sony to work best for you is sort of like setting up a new word processor's Style settings, custom dictionary, etc. that fits what you do.