Which camera, A7s2 or A7r2?

[RoniBurns]

Hi

 

I am looking to buy a new camera and am torn between the A7r2 or the A7s2. I am a videographer by trade and work for a company that has a lot of kit already and I am also a very keen photographer. My old 5Dmrk2 and 24-105 lens has broke and i have some money form the insurance company to replace it. I am extremely keen to get one of the sony series as i a have been amazed by what they are achieving. I also love the size of them and as i work on a sony fs7 a lot i want to stream flow my cameras. 

 

My problem is do i buy a A7s2 which i now will be better for filming but not as good for photographs, or an A7r2 which is amazing for photos but not as good for video. I would prefer to buy the A7r2 as i want a good camera for my personal stills. Has any one used the A7r2 for much video and could any one recommend one over the other for what i want? i would say that i will use the camera 50/50 for stills and video.  

 

Many thanks

[Guest Peter Kelly]

Definitely a tough call for someone who is mainly into video; the other way it is much more straightforward!

 

The bottom line is to decide if there is likely to be a situation with either camera where it won't do what you absolutely need, but the other one would.

Clearly, the areas to consider are low light, AF, and resolution.

 

As far as low light is concerned, the A7Sii is the winner, although not by a huge margin (epecially in resized stills), but when you are at the edge it might be enough of a factor.

The AF is definitely better in the A7Rii in all but very low light. However, I never really found the A7S troublesome or that slow for stills (sorry, don't do much video).

For stills the A7Rii is miles better and gives the option of big crops in good light, but I did like the look of the A7S. Video is more complex, as the A7Sii offers full sensor readout, but the A7Rii Super35 mode nearly matches the quality except in very low light.

 

So, in a nutshell, if you often find the need for very low light video, are happy with manual focus when necessary, and don't crop often, the A7Sii is the camera for you.

But, if you don't need the best low light ability, prefer the better AF, and can make use of cropping, then the A7Rii is best.

 

Here's a useful vdeo comparison:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-aJby2XzX8#t=2m08s

[Gilgenberg]

do you really need such big file size for your still´s for print out?

 

if not A7SII has great IQ, also for stills, and smaller file size is also not bad....... faster processing...better image composing...less problems with 3rd party wide angle lenses.

[oneand0]

This is a tough one, and a lot of money to spend on either one. I think Peter nailed it in explaining how to go with either one. That video linked above was well done in showing the differences. I own both and purchased each one right when they came out. I too have gravitated to 50/50 with what I do as a serious hobby.

 

If I had to drop one right now it would be the A7SII. My reasoning for that is, I can almost get the same high ISO and noise reduction in video, by going Super35 mode on A7RII. I would just have to use wide lenses to compensate. Also the auto focus on the A7RII is that much better than the A7SII. There is a serious difference in the auto focus tracking capability at continuous high, between the two cameras, of course the A7RII being the better. The size of the prints and amount you can crop in if needed the A7RII puts out, is amazing.

 

With all that being said, I tend to grab the A7SII more often when I am just going out on a hike or outing that I do not plan on doing serious photography. Because the image quality if framed right is perfect! The files are smaller and easier to deal with. More than likely I won't be printing and hanging any shots from an outing like that, and if I do, I won't be making them crazy large.

 

Last thing. I would completely miss the 1080p  120fps though! But not worth it for me to make tilt it towards the A7SII as my only camera.

 

Good luck with your choice! 

[Zé De Boni]

Peter Kelly and oneand0 said almost all. Great to have this feedback from serious photographers. I will just add some arguments for your decision, and those are about the lenses that you will use.

If you will shoot full frame video, the PZ 28-135mm f/4 is one of the best options. However, at $2.6K it is the most expensive FE lens (before the 70-200mm f/2.8 is released). It will handle well stills in 12MP. A bit faster and cheaper is the new 24-70mm f/2.8, but I think one stop is not quite an advantage as are the fast primes and it doesn't carry all the features of a lens designed specially for video as the PZ. Anyway, your budget will be quite high.

 

As said, the A7RII has the interesting feature that you can shoot video in full frame or Super35. That means that you may choose different angles of view with the same lens, which sounds tempting, but the IQ is better in the cropped format, as it was also mentioned. So, if you choose this camera body for video you will may get any lens from the sub-frame line. Then, a nice option is the Sony E PZ 18-105mm f/4, which by the way is the kit lens for Sony pro Super35 video cameras as the FS5. I use it for video and stills on my A6000 and it holds well the 24 MP. I guess it will perform great in 4K (I have just made a quick test on the A7RII). The price tag is one fourth of its full frame sister. If you keep the same budget needed for the A7SII combo, you may choose the A7RII, the small PZ and two fast Zeiss primes, which will be great for your stills. Also, you have more affordable options of Sony and Rokkinon full frame primes that are not terrible for the high resolution sensor and perform quite well for video. APSC lenses are also a good option to fill your bag, specially in the wide angle range from 16mm down.

Last but not least, I would recommend the FE 70-200mm f/4, which is very sharp even for 42MP and may add to your video lens range.

[lenoindex]

I think it's quite simple - if your are not sure between the two then definitely get the 7R2/only get 7S2 if you are sure thats what you want.

[Kyron]

I agree with lenoindex. I'm in the same situation as you. Moved on from a 5D Mkiii Canon and am very much into video and photography. The A7RII is the best choice and I haven't regretted it. 

The only real trade off is the low light capabilities. And I need to work in crop mode for video for the best IQ in low light. But that's fine with me as I have a Metabones and lots of EF glass to cover the wide angles. 

 

I've created a resolution comparison image between the A7SII, Fji XT-1, 5D Mark II and A7R II. This puts things in perspective.

There's no way I could live with the A7SII's  photo size.

 

A7SII = Video

A7RII = Both.

 

 

 

 

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[Gilgenberg]

i do not understand the last post

 

it is misleading !

 

the A7S has still an FF Sensor, there is no difference in size

 

Fuji XT1 has APS-C Sensor !......and i can tell you, you will not find so much detail and info in the Fuji XT1 RAW files (although it has 16MP) like you find in the A7S Raw files

 

more Mega Pixel does not mean better IQ although the A7RII Sensor has wonderful IQ

 

and yes......if you not sure ........go for A7RII

[RRRoger]

Sight unseen, I would choose the A7rII.

The A7s is better than the A7sII when shooting Video on a TriPod

[rdgeorge55]

I don't have both but I do have:

 

a7R ii

a7S

 

For all around use, the a7R ii is hard to beat.

[rdgeorge55]

Here is an interesting development:

 

Jeff Berlin has completed a feature length film using the a7R ii (not the a7S ii).  He used Leica Summicron C cinema lenses using a Wooden Camera PL mount to E mount adapter.

[Kyron]

i do not understand the last post

 

it is misleading !

 

the A7S has still an FF Sensor, there is no difference in size

Sorry for the confusion, that image is showing the pixel resolution of final images, not size of sensor.

Both cameras have full frame sensors, but no where near the same photo sizes.

 

- A7sii (12mp sensor) produces an image at its max settings of 4240 x 2832

- A7rii (42mp sensor) produces an image at its max settings of 7952 x 5304

[IamJF]

If you are working as a proffessional videographer I would suggest the A7sii - cause the chance is high you can rent it for productions. So it will pay off over time. 4k of a fullframe sensor is something you dont have every day in a camera. (Low light, DoF)

Akso - do you have productions in 4k or FullHD? As far as I know A7s is the absolute best in HD (when you don't convert 4K down in Computer). Does anybody know a comparison of A7s/ii vs. A7rii/A6300 in HD?

 

But if it's your private tool and you need good autofocus - A7rii for sure! A7s AF is nohow near for moving objects.

 

The combi A7rii and A7s (old version) would be great - that's what I am aiming for ;-) (using A7s at the moment)

[RRRoger]

I had the A7sII, sent it back and kept the A7s.

I do not shoot Video hand held and think the A7s is terrible for stills.

Then again, I hate all the A series cameras.

They are un-ergonomic, have lousy menus and terrible Auto ISO.

The only Sony lens I like is the 28-135 Cine and it cost more than the camera.

It also takes an 7Q+ to DownRes the 4k to get a really good Video.

 

We now have a third choice: the Nikon D500

So far, after only using it twice, it has beat the A7s in every way up to ISO 16,000

Superb Handling, Auto Focus, Auto ISO, Auto White Balance for Stills and Video.

In Video you can adjust the EV if needed, use 3D lighting and more

[reyh66]

there is a test and A7R2 beats the A7S2 in focus tracking... for ISO noise believe me it is not much difference..

[IamJF]

RRRoger - Wich lens do you use for your wide video shots? The D500 crops a lot if I remember right?

I'm sure it's a better cam for stills and it's ok you don't like the A7 cams. ;-)

[rdgeorge55]

RRRoger is delusional.  His choice.

[rdgeorge55]

Just released - Outside Magazine's Gear of the Year award - Sony a7Sii

Just about every major publication picked the a7Rii as Camera of the Year

 

Don't feed the trolls....

[RRRoger]

RRRoger - Wich lens do you use for your wide video shots? The D500 crops a lot if I remember right?

I'm sure it's a better cam for stills and it's ok you don't like the A7 cams. ;-)

I use an "old" AFS 17-35 f/2.8 Nikkor. Much of the time I use f/8 to increase the depth of Field.

It is much sharper than any Sony lens I have used.

At 17mm is is surprisingly wider than the Sony 28-135 Cine at 28mm where I have done most of my Videos.

I have had good results with this lens on my A&s but prefer the power zoom and AF capability of the Cine lens.

 

The "old" 28-70 and 80-200 Nikkors are also very good for video.

What Nikon now needs is a FullFrame Cine lens with power zoom.

Even at $2,500-3,000, I would be one of the first to get one.

[RRRoger]

RRRoger is delusional.  His choice.

Not really.

 

Perhaps you could call me a Nikon "FanBoy" but that is because the first Nikon camera I used fit my hand and shooting style and the many I have had since only take a few minutes to set up and start taking excellent pictures.

 

Where Nikon has fallen so far behind is Video even though the D90 was the first DSLR with Video.

Now, they finally have a contender.

My A7s and lens may be for sale soon.

I shot the D500 at ISO 9,000 yesterday and so far I like the results better.

One surprising thing is that when filming the projector screen at the Church I no longer recorded the rolling effect of the Movie (barely noticeable with the eye but magnified by the A7s). Evidently the flicker control works.

I also like being able to use the on camera EV button to control the brightness at the Bowling Alley.

 

For you Canonites, Sony , Panasonic, Olympia, and other "FanBoys" I am glad they make cameras you like because everyone's needs are different.

[Guest]

As an ex-owner of A7s, I want to tell you that the post of @oneand0 is true. If you have the perfect frame and don't need to crop your photos, go with a7sII. But if you are like me, still learning about framing a good picture, you are going to need the space to crop. Unfortunately you don't get this space with the A7s(II). The resolution is 4240 x 2832 and with cropping mine would easily hit below <2000x1500. That kind of sucks if you use your photo's to sell on large prints.

If you are master of framing and don't need to crop, I would say go with the A7sII. The lowlight capabilities, even against the A7rII are phenomenal. As the smaller file size make it easy on your harddrive as well. But if you tend to crop a lot, go with a7rII. As previous post tell you.

A7sII --> If you want a videocamera with good ability to take photos.
A7rII --> if you want a photocamera with good ability to take videos.

[Snowfun]

 

If I used a FS7 for work, I think I'd be more than tempted by the smaller FS5...

If not then what about a BMMCC? (If that's the correct number of Ms and Cs...)

 

Stills? I don't know your needs but for the travel/holiday snaps I take a backup video capable rx1004 can be fun enough.

 

I find that the A7s just isn't "fun to use" (although the low light video capability is fabulous).

[RRRoger]

 

 

"I find that the A7s just isn't "fun to use" (although the low light video capability is fabulous)."

 

 

Agree and the only reason I kept the thing.

I had to add an external 4k recorder and use an 28-135 Cine lens to get really good Video.