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going full frame, but which


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Hello everyone,

My first post to this awesome forum.  I have a rx10 mark1 and want to upgrade to full frame.  My photo needs are food photography and landscape, which i prefer to shoot manual and I have a small budget.  I've been thinking about getting the a7ii but now leaning more to the a7r or just the a7.  Going to the a7rii is out of my budget.  I went by my local camera store and a worker there shoots the a7r and said old lens are great on a7 series bodies for manual shooting.  I'm going to try adapting old lenses to save money, I guess my question is will I gain that much more between the a7 and a7ii, or just go with the a7r which is now running about $1150 to $1200 on ebay.

Thanks

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Welcome aboard.

 

My big questions are, will you be using a tripod? If so the image stablezation on the A7II series won't be a benefit.

 

What types of lenses are you trying to adapt? As you've probably seen in other posts here, adapting lenses doesn't always work.

 

Why are you going full frame? Is it the wider ratio?

 

Honestly I think you'll love the first generation A7 and A7R just fine.  

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First of all: welcome!

 

I use an A7r for landscapes with Minolta A-Mount glass plus the LA-EA4 adapter (it's basically like using the lenses natively on a Sony body, with AF etc.) and older Contax Zess and other glass, so I though I would chime in.

 

If I were to start from scratch like you're about to do, for landscapes I would NOT go full frame at all!

 

Especially with the high resolution sensor in the A7r you will often have to focus stack multiple frames to be able to get everything in decent focus, or use a tilt lens (when you can; not every scene can be "solved" with tilt).

 

Besides, the A7r requires, deceptively being such a small camera, a rock steady tripod because its shutter shakes the Earth! That is, if you want sharp images... This especially using anything longer than 85/100mm.

 

To be clear this is what I mean for rock steady (and what I personally use):

 

Tripod Report 412 (without center column, otherwise you are using a monopod with 3 legs, IMO) + Arca Swiss B1 ball-head 

 

Summing up, my advice would be to stick with an APS-c body, maybe one with full electronic shutter (or at least EFCS) in order to be able to carry a WILDLY lighter tripod.

 

If you intend to use the camera mostly on a tripod, like you should for food and landscapes (not just for the added sharpness, but for better, more carefully planned compositions, IMO) an old inexpensive Nex 7 or an A6000 will be almost perfect.

 

The problem, with these, and again IMO, is the relative lack of high quality glass (compared, say, to Fuji). So consider carefully the lens lineup you might want/need BEFORE buying into a system.

 

You might also consider other brands, ehm (cough cough...) Fuji... (I shoot with both)

 

If so you might want to read this old article of mine (I was considering a full switch, but for the time being I kept both):

 

Giving the boot to Sony? A7r vs Fuji X-T10

 

Summing up:

 

A7r better for > availability of old (but well performing) glass (check my Camerapedia for a few reviews and "fast" ratings); unbeatable sharpness IF AND ONLY IF on a rock steady tripod and head

 

APS-c body > wildly easier to get everything in focus*; lighter and less expensive setup; cheaper; in this case I'd personally chose Fuji, but mostly because of the price and availability of their mostly excellent glass (to give you a few figures, I paid for the ultra sharp stabilized 50-200 less than 300€, and you can get an even sharper 14/2.8 for the same money)

 

Keep in mind that, if you print, using glass of the same "level" and proper sharpening you can reasonably expect to see a meaningful difference (i.e. comparing prints of the same picture side-to-side and not sticking your nose in the print with a magnifying glass in hand, but watching it from a close-but-normal distance) between the 36Mp A7r and a "measly" 16Mp X-T10 from at least 90cm wide, sometimes even 120cm (it will depend on how detailed the subject is). The 24Mp XT-20 will be released next week, btw. :)

 

*this happens because, to get the same frame, due the crop factor you will use on a APS-c camera a shorter lens than on a full frame camera; focal length being independent from the format used, a shorter lens will have an extended depth of field. For example, a 35mm lens on APS-c and 50mm on full frame will give you the same frame (shooting from the same position), but the depth of field of the 35mm lens will be more extensive

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An A7m2 with a Loxia 50 will be perfect for both Food and Landscape photography. That lens is capable of providing character and sharpness as needed, its very versatile. And if you are new to Manual Focus, then don't worry, its easy and the results are superior to what the AF system can deliver when photographing static subjects.

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Dollanganger - If you think that you need comment to the thread "I think I made a mistake" as you are at odds with virtually everyone else.

 

As for me, the main reason I went with Sony Alpha was for the full frame. There were cameras I preferred and with better specs that I discounted because the were APS-C. Full frame and full frame lenses give the best artistic flexibility. I believe a big sensor catching a lot of light and a shallow depth of field can't be beat.

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Dollanganger - If you think that you need comment to the thread "I think I made a mistake" as you are at odds with virtually everyone else.

 

As for me, the main reason I went with Sony Alpha was for the full frame. There were cameras I preferred and with better specs that I discounted because the were APS-C. Full frame and full frame lenses give the best artistic flexibility. I believe a big sensor catching a lot of light and a shallow depth of field can't be beat.

I'm not sure what you mean by this.

 

I recommended the full frame for food and landscapes due to the wider ratio. 

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Thanks everyone,  I ended up get the a7ii with the 55m 1.8 and the 28mm 2.0 for $1980 used and great shape.  I shoot some food yesterday with the 55mm and haven't experienced this type of quality and sharpness.  It blows my old rx10 mark1 out of the water.  Having said that I found that i do need a macro lens with a bit of reach.  I don't want to spend another $1000 for the sony 90 macro and I'm rethinking adapting lenses, as i don't want to if i don't have to.  Anyone have non sony macro lens suggestions?  I'm going to get the rokinon 14mm but wouldn't mind trying to find a wide zoom macro also.  Thanks everyone!

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An A7m2 with a Loxia 50 will be perfect for both Food and Landscape photography. That lens is capable of providing character and sharpness as needed, its very versatile. And if you are new to Manual Focus, then don't worry, its easy and the results are superior to what the AF system can deliver when photographing static subjects.

I picked up the 55mm for $600 and it's great.  Looking for a 90-100ish non sony macro though, if one exists

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Sony la-ea4 adapter (250-ish €) + Minolta (or Sony, they are

the same lens optically) 100/2.8 macro (200-ish).

 

It will behave essentially like a native lens.

 

And should you not need af the la-ea3 adapter will do the job

for 100-ish € less.

    

Thaz a very workable approach. I use an older A-mount 

90 macro on the LAEA3. All A-mount features EXCEPT

autofocus are alive and uncompromised.  

   

------------------------------------------------------------------------  

    

I also use the same 90 on an a6000 when I need tighter 

framing but don't want to crop the a7-II image and lose 

half my pixel count. The a6000 crams 24mp into a the 

APSC format. You wouldn't need that for a dish of food,  

but if you need to shoot, say, a berry or an eye-of-newt 

then the APSC offers twice the pixel count at the same 

image magnification.    

   

-------------------------------------------------------------------------   

   

Maybe I'm spoiled, but I cannot shoot nonzoom macro,  

from a tripod, without a focusing rail. I recommend it.

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I would not go for a7R because of shutter vibrations with long lenses at certain speeds.

 

The value for money of the A7 is hard to beat. 

I have an A7R II, but always take also the A7 with me with a different lens than on the A7 II.

 

If you think that you might do 4K video in the future and can wait, then perhaps you can wait for the A7 III. It's very likely that it will have 4K.

A7 II never interested me much, the same resolution as A7, heavier and no 4K and costs much more. Personally, I don't need IBIS so much, but your mileage may vary.

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  • 1 month later...

Hello everyone,

My first post to this awesome forum.  I have a rx10 mark1 and want to upgrade to full frame.  My photo needs are food photography and landscape, which i prefer to shoot manual and I have a small budget.  I've been thinking about getting the a7ii but now leaning more to the a7r or just the a7.  Going to the a7rii is out of my budget.  I went by my local camera store and a worker there shoots the a7r and said old lens are great on a7 series bodies for manual shooting.  I'm going to try adapting old lenses to save money, I guess my question is will I gain that much more between the a7 and a7ii, or just go with the a7r which is now running about $1150 to $1200 on ebay.

Thanks

 

I would buy the a7s which I have. And if you did video it is the B camera alongside many camcorders like the FS7. I have the a7s FF 6300 and lens. I really like the RX10 III with the 24 600 lens. Not great on shallow depth field but all around bridge camera wow. 

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