Flash recommendations

[ShotGal]

I'm new to A7xx - I have an outdoor event shoot I'm planning ahead for and probably need to pick up a single on camera flash unit for soft fill in bright sun or as the main light in shaded areas.  (Shooting with a 24-70 2.8 - so not far away)  It probably needs to be wide enough to cover up to 20 people without going dark on the edges/sides.

 

There won't be much if any indoor shooting at all.  I just need something that can cover couples and small groups with soft light - without getting too hot.   I assume the camera TTL control dials it down on compatible flash units...

 

Seems like I should maybe just get the HVL-F43M and call it a day - but any other comments are welcome!  There's always a chance I'd want it to trigger 1-2 off camera flashes for other project or bigger groups in the future...

 

The only other concern would be battery life - I'd like to avoid something that requires 4-6 AA batteries every 30 minutes.  I probably only need a hundred pops, max, but over 3 hours.

 

One small wrinkle - I already own a new HVL-F56AM (currently try to sell off) - according to this (attached) - I could theoretically use the HVL-F20M and it would trigger the 56 wirelessly (at the right power levels)?  Of course it would have to be off camera...  Interestingly the 43M or 60M are not compatible for wirelessly triggering the 56.    Or get a 20M (as the trigger) and a 43M.

 

Just not sure what to go with...  I just need the camera to bump the level of the fill gently - so it doesn't look like a spotlight.
 

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[michelb]

The 43 will control the 56 in WL mode using the. Ctrl/Ctrl2 mode which is the old style WL protocol.

 

Bonus with this set-up: you can even specify ratios between your on board 43 and the WL 56, therefore by spreading the power between the 2 units, you should be able to shoot a lot of pictures before changing batteries

Another bonus is that as long as the 56 has its head pointed like it does in direct flash position, HSS will be available from both units but of course with reduced GN

 

I tried it outside in direct sunlight ( 2 HVL-F43AM with A77) and the max 15 feet between on camera flash and remote was not a problem and the bright sunligth did not seem to affect the IR language between the 2 units.

 

The fact that these are still compatible (the HVL-F56AM is actually the old Minolta 5600 HS(D) from about 2001) is quite an underestimated feature of these slightly more expensive units

 

You could also use the 56 on camera using the Sony ADP-MAA adapter

 

The 20 is only a very basic flash that does control in basic WL but no ratios are possible (same would apply to the HVL-F32M) and no HSS. This has a GN of only 14 when used in the normal position which is for a coverage of about 50mm only and in WL control, it does not really contribute to exposure (only the last control flash telling the remotes to stop lighting) is actually visible which is very very little light.

 

Some will offer other solutions from other brands but compatibility may become an issue either immediately or later

 

You should test your set-up before starting to shoot as the TTL system sometimes requires exposure adjustment in some conditions. My experience in daylight is about minus 1.5 EV for the flash control (this can be set in the camera using the flash exp compensation separately from the normal exposure correction). The 43 offers this direct on its rear dial but i am not certain it affects the remote flashes when this flash is used as a controller

[ShotGal]

Thanks for all the excellent information!  It's very helpful and much appreciated.

As I was doing my research and after your post I was also shopping around a bit and found someone locally on Craigslist selling both a 43M and 43AM (like new) at a great price ($300 for both!) so I jumped on it.

 

I'll have to play with them to see what config works best.  I may only need one - but triggering 2 or 3 is an interesting thought as well to experiment with - though would need light stands or volunteers (HLS).  I know in the old days it was important to get the flash up off of the camera itself - but not sure about the new flashes.

 

This guide by Michael Hohner really helps to show what's possible... - http://mhohner.de/sony-minolta/flashcomp_setups.php#wireless

I've seen talk of GoDox, Nissin, Phottix, Metz and more - but seems like many the Sony are a safer bet for current and future compatibility.

 

Thanks again - very useful info!

[michelb]

Hey these wireless flashes come with a small support. all you need is a shelf/table or clamp with tripod screw to mount them to a post, a branch or a piece of furniture.

 

At the price you paid these, you now have a backup and if loaded with batteries and set-up properly before your event, you won't need to change batteries

[ShotGal]

One more - quick one.  As a matter of opinion - shooting from the distance of 20' in full mid-day sun - do you think a single TTL on camera HVL F43M (or AM) is up to the task of covering the fill on a group of people? (4-10)

My experience is with studio level flashes only outdoors.  Testing the F43M - it just seems really super weak.

[michelb]

That will depend on your settings (ISO /Aperture/ If HSS is needed or not to match ambient light)

[ShotGal]

I'll shoot in A mode and do Auto ISO - Multi metering and spot focus.  For groups probably f4-8 to make sure everyone is in focus.

It's just a question of if I have to shoot groups from closer (for more flash efficacy) with a wider angle (24mm FF), or get more lens compression from further out. (85mm FF)

 

I've started doing some tests shots and just not sure yet if I have it covered or need a bigger gun!

[ShotGal]

Just an update to this thread - I've been doing some test shots and find that using spot metering (& focus) is going to be preferred over multi - so the ambient doesn't accidentally derail the exposure of the subject(s).  The 43 seems to have enough reach for small groups and if I want/need to dial back ambient with faster shutter speeds and use HSS, it's working pretty well.

So to keep it simple and portable (since I'm flying there too), it's probably just going to be the 43M on the main camera (A7RII) - part of the time (just for groups and possibly some individual portraits).  On the portraits I'll probably use -.3 to -.7 flash compensation so nothing gets blown out from direct flash.  If I had assistance I'd consider going to triggers and light stand(s) - or one to carry the key light on a pole... and hold reflectors, but I'm on my own for this one!  

[Guest Jaf-Photo]

Seems like a good choice. 43M has nice light and can cover a bit of surface and distance.

 

I've used the Nissin i40 in portable situations. It's small and light and balances well on an A7 camera. But it does vignette and the light is a tad harsh and cold. But for the size and price it's a nice thing to have in your bag.