EVF: composing vs reviewing

[bwud]

Has anyone noticed a difference in quality between composing and reviewing images with the EVF (in this case, A7r ii)?

 

It is usually apparent in high contrast scenarios, where bright colors get washed out while composing.

 

The only way I could really think to demonstrate is by taking a smartphone picture of the EVF, which is far from ideal, but regardless you can somewhat see what I'm talking about: when compared to the review picture, the greens of the grass are speckled and dull, and the red of the bricks under direct sunlight are desaturated.

 

Toggling the Display Quality option doesn't make a difference.

 

Is there any way to fix this? 

 

 

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[Gilgenberg]

do you have selected live view in the menu?

 

it looks like the difference comes from the +1 EV you have selected 

 

 

 

 

 

P.S........nice view...(-:

[bwud]

do you have selected live view in the menu?

 

 

I have the EVF selected.

 

 

 

it looks like the difference comes from the +1 EV you have selected

 

There isn't a +1 EV selected, that's just the meter. Camera is in manual without EC. Images are both at the same exposure, the only difference is one is pre-capture, and one is post-capture.

 

P.S........nice view...(-:

 

 

Thanks, it'll do

[bwud]

Here's another example, where what I'm describing is more obvious.

 

The bright high contrast sticks look a bit like color moire while composing, but look fine while reviewing.

 

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[Gilgenberg]

o.k. i am not super shure if i´m right but try it...i have a A7S so maybe the menu is a little bit different:

 

1st.  

 

at the 2nd layer in the Menu at the 3rd window you must select Live View "on" (first entry)

 

2nd

 

the EV Control has influence to pre view, if live view is not on you don´t see the difference if you use the Exposing correction wheel in your case (+1)

 

like in your 1st example the EV control wheel was set, so it is logic that after your capture the image is lighter (+1EV) so green gets more yellow and high lights look more washed out. 

 

i hope this helps as i don´t have the A7RII......)-:

[Gilgenberg]

sorry now i checked it ......you was in Manual mode...and yes it is the meter " +1" but the effect is the same

 

look if you have checked the live view mode correctly !

 

if live view is checked on my camera there is absolutely no difference in pre and after exposure

 

i looked in the A7RII manual it is at the

 

2nd layer

 

custom settings:

 

"Live View Display" must be switched "ON"

[Zé De Boni]

.

...i have a A7S so maybe the menu is a little bit different:

You are right. Life view works in the same way in any Sony mirrorless or SLT camera. It just keeps moving around the menu pages. LOL.

[bwud]

o.k. i am not super shure if i´m right but try it...i have a A7S so maybe the menu is a little bit different:

 

1st.  

 

at the 2nd layer in the Menu at the 3rd window you must select Live View "on" (first entry)

 

2nd

 

the EV Control has influence to pre view, if live view is not on you don´t see the difference if you use the Exposing correction wheel in your case (+1)

 

like in your 1st example the EV control wheel was set, so it is logic that after your capture the image is lighter (+1EV) so green gets more yellow and high lights look more washed out. 

 

i hope this helps as i don´t have the A7RII......)-:

 

Thanks Gildenburg. And yes, it was on.

 

 

Here's how the camera was set.

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[michelb]

The view before the exposure is reality

 

The view after exposure is equivalent to a JPG that was processed by camera so some form of DRO has been applied and tries to lower the highlight/ shadow density range differences.

 

It will always be like this.

 

Try using DRO OFF in the DRO menu, this will minimize its effect but the fact that the camera still applies some form of Dynamic Range in post process will always make a difference

 

If you shoot RAW + JPG your RAW's will actually look more like what you saw in the EVF before exposure but you can not check that on camera

[Golem]

do you have selected live view in the menu?

 

it looks like the difference comes from the

+1 EV you have selected 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No need to "select" live view. You do that

when you choose to use a Sony camera,

as they are live-view only.

 

Possibly you refer to choosing the  "Effect

Preview" in the Live View menu. And as to

that, I very much agree about your remark

about the +1 EV exposure bias. However,

regardless of "Effect Preview" use or not,

the composing/viewing image is seldom

overly similar to the playback/review of a

recorded image. This is intentional. Two

different purposes are served and each is

best served by different behaviors of the

EVF [same goes for the LCD monitor].   

  

The finder image in a Nikon F or Leica M

looks almost nothing like the captured and

printed image from the film, and likewise

the finder image in a Digital SLR, Digital

M-Leica, or digital Fuji-Pro look extremely

different vs playback of recorded images.

You get used to it.

[bwud]

"very much agree about your remark about the +1 EV exposure bias"

 

But again, there was no exposure bias set, you're just seeing the meter.

 

I'm certainly used to the VF being different from capture, I shot SLR cameras for years and still do. With a mirrorless camera isn't one of the features the ability to have a what you see is what you get display?

[Gilgenberg]

so as i wrote:

 

with my camera there is absolutely no difference in pre and post

 

but i shoot RAW only

 

...maybe something is wrong with your camera

[Zé De Boni]

"very much agree about your remark about the +1 EV exposure bias"

 

But again, there was no exposure bias set, you're just seeing the meter.

 

You are shooting RAW, so you can easily correct the exposure in post, the only problem being that this overexposure means that you could have used a faster speed (or smaller ISO). But this is not the solution for your case.

There are many controls that may cause this error (DRO, Creative style, Picture Profile, Picture Effect), but I cannot find a way that this could happen with Setting Effect ON. All controls that affect the resulting image do the same to the lifeview visualization.

A real problem could be a faulty diaphragm, when the lens doesn't close it at the right amount, which is very rare with electronic activated lenses, or an uncalibrated shutter.

About the exposure, I must disagree with you: THERE WAS AN EXPOSURE BIAS!!! 

The meter indication of +1 means that if you take a picture with that setting, you will get one stop overexposure. Surely, this depends on the metering pattern that you choose, spot, centerweight or matrix. But your Manual settings of ISO 100, 1/200 and f/5.6 are compatible with an overexposure of two stops as it appears in that light condition, unless you are using some filter or the photo was taken during a partial solar eclipse. 1/200 and f/11 should be the correct exposure for the sunlit areas of your image. It seems that the camera meter is taking the shadow areas into account, so the balanced result is just one f-stop up for the lightmeter. However, the washed out areas in the sky are typical of two stops overexposure. So the resulting image was right and the problem lies in the lifeview representation that was darker than it should.

That is why Gilgenberg's first guess was the most appropriate. When Setting Effect is OFF the lifeview image is balanced so that it looks like viewing through an optical finder, just as it is in your example.

A technical remark is needed here. One should rather rely on the meter indication and/or the histogram for correctly exposing, no matter how accurately the lifeview resembles the resulting image. Despite its great advantages for visualizing an image as compared to optical finders, lifeview will always be just an indication, moreover as you may change so many things later on the software (contrast, micro contrast, vibrance, saturation...). Calibrating your monitor (MENU, TOOL BOX, Page 1) is not the solution either, as any change there affects both the pre and after visualization.

My suggestion is that you repeat your test with a correct exposure and with Histogram on, then compare it with the resulting histogram. Then do some exposure bracket. If the pre and post histograms show clear differences, then the camera is not behaving as it should. If they are similar, then something must be affecting your lifeview display, be it a wrong setting or a faulty camera.

[bwud]

There are many controls that may cause this error (DRO, Creative style, Picture Profile, Picture Effect), but I cannot find a way that this could happen with Setting Effect ON. All controls that affect the resulting image do the same to the lifeview visualization.

 

That's what I would expect.

 

You are shooting RAW, so you can easily correct the exposure in post, the only problem being that this overexposure means that you could have used a faster speed (or smaller ISO).

 

 

The exposure is fine. There's nothing that needs correcting in the resulting image. I'm only trying to understand why the live view looks different from the review view given setting effect is ON.

 

About the exposure, I must disagree with you: THERE WAS AN EXPOSURE BIAS!!! 

The meter indication of +1 means that if you take a picture with that setting, you will get one stop overexposure. Surely, this depends on the metering pattern that you choose, spot, centerweight or matrix.

 

Ah, I see what you mean. When I said there was no exposure bias, I meant I had not dialed in "EC." Yes, I was exposing differently from what the camera thought to be correct given the selected metering program. From my canon dSLR experience, I habitually shoot landscapes with the spot meter and expose about a stop past center. It's fair to call that a bias. However, what I'm not understanding is why that would cause live view to look different from Review, given that Setting Effect is ON. And, for the record, I see a difference even if I expose dead center.

 

That is why Gilgenberg's first guess was the most appropriate. When Setting Effect is OFF the lifeview image is balanced so that it looks like viewing through an optical finder, just as it is in your example.

 

I've often wondered about that, and I posted a thread here asking about what exposure settings I'm seeing with it off. I figured it was attempting to emulate an OVF, but... how? What effective shutter speed is it equating to a constant delivery of light? Oh well, that's a question for a different thread.

 

My suggestion is that you repeat your test with a correct exposure and with Histogram on, then compare it with the resulting histogram. Then do some exposure bracket. If the pre and post histograms show clear differences, then the camera is not behaving as it should. If they are similar, then something must be affecting your lifeview display, be it a wrong setting or a faulty camera.

 

The histograms don't change pre- and post-capture, just what I see on the screen. Any ideas which settings, aside from Setting Effect, could affect live view display?

 

Thanks for the detailed responses!